Dan Rust, Vice President, Global Leadership & Commercial Development, Infopro Learning
Dan Rust is the Vice President of Global Leadership and Commercial Development at Infopro Learning and a recognized thought leader in leadership and organizational development. With over 30 years of experience, Dan has helped organizations develop leaders who can navigate complexity, change, and transformation. He is the author of the bestselling book “Workplace Poker” and the host of the “Leadership Disrupted” podcast, where he explores modern leadership challenges. Dan regularly speaks at industry events and shares insights on leadership, culture, and workplace transformation. His work focuses on helping leaders create environments where employees feel empowered, engaged, and psychologically safe during times of rapid change.
Nolan Hout, Senior Vice President, Growth, Infopro Learning
Nolan Hout is the growth leader and host of this podcast. He has over a decade of experience in the Learning & Development (L&D) industry, helping global organizations unlock the potential of their workforce. Nolan is results-driven, investing most of his time in finding ways to identify and improve the performance of learning programs through the lens of return on investment. He is passionate about networking with people in the learning and training community. He is also an avid outdoorsman and fly fisherman, spending most of his free time on rivers across the Pacific Northwest.
Artificial Intelligence (AI) is transforming the workplace at an unprecedented pace, both opportunity and uncertainty. In this episode of the podcast, Infopro Learning experts, Dan and Nolan explore how leaders can build psychological safety while navigating the disruptive impact of AI in the workplace.
Listen to the episode to find out:
- What psychological safety really means and why it matters in today’s workplace.
- How AI is reshaping roles, productivity expectations, and workforce structures.
- Why should leaders avoid becoming blind cheerleaders for AI.
- The connection between transparency, trust and employee engagement.
- How leaders can address employee fears about AI and job security.
- Why honesty is essential when communicating about layoffs and technological change.
- How AI acts as an amplifier of existing skills rather than a replacement for them.
- The role of leaders in helping teams adapt to rapid technological transformation.
- Practical ways managers can foster open conversations about AI and uncertainty.
Psychological safety is creating an environment where people feel comfortable taking interpersonal risks, where they can say what they really think without fear of retaliation.
Vice President, Global Leadership & Commercial Development, Infopro Learning
Introduction
Nolan: Hello everyone and welcome to the Learning and Development podcast. As always, I’m your host, Nolan, and this is sponsored by Infopro Learning. Joining me today we have a friend of mine and a colleague, Dan Rust, Vice President here at Infopro Learning who leads our leadership and development practice. For over 30 years now, Dan has been establishing himself as a thought leader in leadership and organizational development. He’s written a bestselling book called Workplace Poker. It’s still very relevant and you should check it out.
Dan also launched a podcast about six months ago called Leadership Disrupted that is really taking off. Check that out as well. Dan also speaks at several events throughout the year. Follow him on LinkedIn and you’ll see he’s always talking about themes that are very timely, which is why we wanted Dan on today.
We’re going to talk about a topic that is very current. As of today, November 14th, last week there was a large announcement with huge numbers of layoffs. The number one source of those layoffs was cited as AI, most notably with Amazon cutting over 25,000 jobs. That creates an interesting environment around the world.
We’re simultaneously embracing AI and trying to leverage AI. A big message being shared is that AI isn’t taking jobs. But at the same time, it is taking jobs. So how do we navigate this world of AI while still making people feel psychologically safe? To help us unpack that, we’ve got Dan Rust. Dan, thanks for joining us today.
Psychological Safety Explained
Dan: Hey Nolan, it is great to be with you. I’m excited about this topic. It’s a recurring theme on my Leadership Disrupted podcast as well — the impact of AI, psychological safety, and how you authentically create a safe environment for employees.
How do you communicate “there’s nothing to fear” when the reality is that there is something to fear? How do you authentically help employees navigate AI and be the leader they need today while also preparing them for the future? AI is shifting and evolving rapidly. We must think about what kind of leader people will need in 2030. Because 2030 may arrive sooner than we expect.
Nolan: That’s exactly why I reached out to you. A few years ago, you did a series about how to lead through layoffs and uncertainty. We’re still in that environment of uncertainty, and now we’ve layered AI on top of it. For people who may not know the term, what is psychological safety and why is it important in the workforce?
Dan: In one sentence, psychological safety is creating an environment where people feel comfortable taking risks, especially interpersonal risks, without fear of retaliation. Retaliation is rarely direct. It’s more subtle. Someone might ask a question that leadership doesn’t want to ask. Instead of being punished directly, they may slowly stop being invited to meetings or start being viewed as a troublemaker.
In the AI space, many employees tell me they’re trying to make AI work in their job but they’re struggling. When they bring those struggles up, they sense leadership doesn’t want to hear it. Leaders saw a demo where AI worked instantly and expect the same results.
Psychological safety means someone can say exactly what they think, even when it may not be what the leader wants to hear.
The Impact of AI on Employee Behavior
Nolan: I think it really comes down to creating an environment where people can perform at their best. If someone is struggling with an AI tool but afraid to say it, you’re not getting the full value of that employee.
Dan: Exactly. I heard about a company that announced that AI tools would reduce video production time by 50%. Leadership showed examples they found online. But the employee producing the video still had to rely mostly on traditional tools.
He told leadership it was AI-generated because that was the expectation. He worked late at nights making it happen. But the reality wasn’t shared. In a psychologically safe environment he could have said, “I can do part of this with AI, but I still need my existing tools.” Then leadership could adjust expectations.
Leadership and Building Psychological Safety
Dan: One mistake leaders make is thinking psychological safety is a soft skill. It’s one of the hardest leadership skills. You can’t just say “be transparent” and expect people to suddenly feel safe. Some employees will hide more if they don’t trust the environment.
Every person has a story beneath their story. Leaders need to pay attention to what people say, how they say it, and what they avoid saying.
Nolan: I tend to take things at face value, which my wife says is a flaw.
Dan: I used to struggle reading people as well. I had to deliberately learn to read the room. That’s where my book Workplace Poker came from. Once you learn to listen carefully, you start hearing the story beneath the story.
AI as a Double-Edged Sword
Nolan: How do leaders create psychological safety when the very tool helping productivity is also making people feel unsafe?
Dan: First rule: don’t be an AI cheerleader. You can be an advocate without pretending AI has no downsides. People know the risks. Some careers have already been disrupted by AI.
Pretending everything is perfect destroys credibility. Leaders should acknowledge that AI is both powerful and disruptive. Technology isn’t going away, so organizations must learn to use it while supporting employees through the transition.
Honesty as a Leadership Strategy
Dan: Great leaders don’t tell little lies. They tell the truth in a thoughtful way. Sometimes you can’t share everything, but that doesn’t mean you create a false reality. Employees see through that.
If you tell the truth, you force yourself to communicate honestly rather than avoid conflict. Ironically, AI itself can help with this. Tools like ChatGPT are great at reframing difficult messages in a positive and authentic way.
AI and Skill Amplification
Dan: AI is an amplifier. If someone already has strong skills, AI amplifies those skills. Mid-career professionals often benefit the most because they have expertise to amplify.
But for students and early-career employees, AI can become a crutch that prevents them from building foundational skills. Without those foundations, they lack the judgment needed to evaluate AI outputs.
Leading in an Uncertain AI Future
Nolan: How do leaders create predictability when the future of AI itself is unpredictable?
Dan: Be honest about that uncertainty. You can say:
“I’m learning AI just like you. I don’t know exactly where it will lead, but we’re going to learn together.”
Leaders don’t always have to lead from the front. Sometimes they lead from the side or even from behind. What matters is staying engaged and guiding the journey rather than abandoning it.
Psychological Safety as an Ongoing Process
Dan: Psychological safety is not something you achieve once and check off a list. It’s an ongoing process. Different employees require different levels of reassurance. Some will always feel uncertain, and leaders must continually work to build trust. You cannot guarantee safety in an organization, but you can guarantee your intent and your support.
Conclusion
Nolan: One takeaway is to use news events like AI-related layoffs as reminders to check in with employees. If you’re seeing those headlines, your employees probably are too.
Dan: Exactly. Honest conversations are essential. And if listeners want more discussions like this, they can check out the Leadership Disrupted podcast.
Nolan: Thanks, Dan. I appreciate you joining us.
Dan: Thank you.
